WHAT ABOUT THE JOJ LYRICS?
The lyrics Jessicka wrote for her band Jack Off Jill have been brought up many times in the discussion about these allegations. Sure, the themes of the songs are something that comes to mind, it's no wonder really that someone brings up their songs in a discussion about rape allegations. Especially as Jessicka herself has brought them up too, implying that the presence of the theme of abuse in her lyrics from the 90's proves something... On this page we'll take a look, but TL;DR is that no, they are not exactly very good evidence and more so could also be used to argue against her claims.
So first, when looking into it, you must understand two things:
1. Jack Off Jill was a Riot Grrrl band. Riot Grrrl was a feminist underground punk movement, and these bands would discuss feminist issues in their songs; rape, misogyny, sexism, domestic violence.
2. Jack Off Jill was formed in 1992, it was already a Riot Grrrl band with these lyrical themes before Jessicka and Jeordie started dating in 1993 (according to Jessicka, Jeordie's version about when and how long this relationship was is still unheard)
Jack Off Jill played it's first show in early 1993, opening for Marilyn Manson. At this time, Jeordie was still a member of Amboog-A-Lard. The things Jessicka describes him doing, can be placed with evidence to have allegedly happened much later. (Alleged rape during the NIN tour 1994 after being "unfaithful" on tour with Courtney would place it somewhere in fall 1994 and the "Twiggy dress" came along around 1995.)
Jack Off Jill songs that existed already in 1993 are most likely not about the relationship with Jeordie, since alleged rape and identity theft could not have happened yet at the time.
Not only that, but generally, domestic violence is a topic that an artist or a songwriter can feel strongly about without being personally affected by it, many artists have written songs about it despite not personally having been victimized, for example to take part in a campaign to bring awareness to the subject. Art is all about telling stories, a female songwriter in a feminist band can very well feel strongly for this subject, it doesn't mean by itself that the songs are about a specific event/person. Even if there had been songs written during or after the relationship about this subject, it isn't conclusive proof of anything else than Jessicka personally having empathy for those affected by domestic violence, and that this topic may be personally something that has affected her at some point of her life.
A song I could mention as an example of art being about telling stories is "Daddy" by Korn, which is about the vocalist Jonathan Davis' experience of being molested as a child and not being believed by his parents. The song, though called "daddy" and containing lyrics like "fuck your own child" was later specified by Jonathan as NOT being about his father, but a neighbor that had babysitted him. The theme of the song caused people to mistakenly believe his father had sexually abused him, but in fact the song was telling a story, inspired by what had happened, not the exact story of what had happened. This is exactly the issue with this "JOJ lyrics claim" too. In art, personal experiences or strong emotions about a subject are modified to a story often in such a way that it effectively and relatably delivers the emotions portrayed to the listener.
So. What songs already existed before the alleged events? This might surprise you.
According to Setlist.fm, These songs were already in the setlist in early 1993:
-Bruises are Back in Style
-Smell you from Here
There's also video footage available on youtube of these songs being played live in 1993.
Let's look at My Cat:
"Song Index: The Story Behind The Song My Cat By Jack Off Jill" Hit Parader, 1998
My Cat, the first single may seem like an ode to the cherished house pet, but with closer inspection lead vocalist and front woman Jessicka tells Hit Parader: "My Cat is about a movie called Ruben and Ed… Crispen Glover is Ruben Farr and is basically a shut in who is all alone in the world except that he has a dead cat that carries in a cooler across the desert. During a dream sequence he states, "My cat can eat a whole watermelon."
From the beginning, Jack Off Jill which also consists of bassist Robin (Agent) Moulder, guitarist HoHo Spade and drummer Laura Simpson believe in writing only honest songs - straight from the heart songs rather than what the record company thinks they should be writing. "We can't help but relate to the character Ruben in the movie," Jessicka sums up. "The character represents everything I saw in myself and my significant other at the time. At that point in my life, he was this hero in platforms with offbeat humor and an awareness of his own insanity…. somebody I could marry!"
It's not exactly stated when it was that Jeordie and Jessicka started dating, but it was in 1993. But Jeordie wasn't exactly known for wearing platforms yet at the time, he was still more a thrash metal guy. But in the dream sequence she's talking about, the movie character is wearing huge platform boots. Jeordie did wear platform boots later, so she may associate them with him in her memory as at the time of this interview, 1998 Jeordie did wear platform boots.
This song, even if it predates the relationship, also could fit the Jeordie timeline though because well, you may be crushing on someone a long time before a relationship starts. In some messages I have received from people who claim to know someone who was around in those times (note; this is still unverified information but may be true, I mention this partly as request for more info?) it was said that Jessicka was really crushing on him before they started dating.
My Cat was released also in 1994 as a 7" vinyl.
In a Jack Off Jill Newsletter from 1997
Q: "Was there ever a naked Twiggy 7 inch disc?" (from Candygirl@aol.com -no longer a valid Email address)
Jessicka: "No! It's really a long joke between him and I. There's not - there could have been! - but there's not. It's actually a rumor that got started before he had even joined Marilyn Manson, and I don't know how it even got to anyone else!"
So... It could be that My Cat is about Jeordie and it also could be that they were joking about putting a naked picture of him on the 7" vinyl.
And well, there is a line like "he can break my arm in seven places" in the song, but uh, Jeordie is not a cat, he was not on TV at the time as said in the song and this is a reference to a movie at the same time, it's would be kind of a reach to make this into a song about an abusive relationship. And if it was one, they'd probably not have joked about printing him onto the 7" and Jessicka would not be using the tags like #mycat on social media...
It's also very interesting that the song Boy Grinder already existed at this time, since the following lyrics have been brought up in discussions as proof that since Jessicka wrote a song like this, her claims must be true;
Like it more...
"Strolls on south
Steal my old clothes"
And well, considering that Jessicka did accuse Jeordie of rape and stealing her look, it's no wonder that people have brought this up, but this song cannot be about him, because it existed before it allegedly happened. Here's a performance of Boy Grinder live in 1993 on youtube. A year prior to the NIN tour during which the alleged rape would've happened. It is of course uploaded by a fan who provides no further information as to what show this exactly was, but Jessicka does not have her dread extensions or black hair yet, nor is she wearing makeup yet, these things came along later as JOJ developed to a gothier look in 1994 - 1995, so her stage outfit does align with this being 1993 and a very early JOJ show.
These songs were also on a cassette called Children 5 and Up, released 1993. Again, before fall 1994. On this cassette, there's also a song called Spit And Rape with the following lyrics:
I know who you are
You left a big black scar
I see there's no escape
You'll know when
Fucker you're going down, girl you're going down, fucker you're going down,
You and spit and rape
Fucker you're going down, girl you're going down, fucker you're going down,
You and spit and rape
The alleged rape during a NIN tour had not happened yet at the time this song was written, so this is not about Jeordie.
Unknown JOJ facts about Jessicka:
Jessicka originally wanted to call JOJ -Jack In Jill, somnolent (meaning of a kind likely to induce sleep), the pills, or drowsy. In the early days of JOJ Jessicka would stay up for days and days on end in order to hallucinate naturally. Some of the song titles such as Lollirot, Boygrinder, & Cherry Scented from the demos came from sleep deprived delusions. Her coconspirator Manson suffered the same heat insomnia. They made a pact that whoever could stay up the longest got to be a huge rock star. Needless to say he stayed up 45 minutes longer then she did. Perhaps in her sleep deprived state he convinced her on settling on the name Jack Off Jill.
But where do these abuse themes come from, then?
Well, before the allegations towards Jeordie, Jessicka maintained in interviews that it was in fact, her childhood, formative years, that inspired her lyrics. Here are some quotes that could, in her own words, explain, where these lyrical themes came from:
This is taken from the 5th issue of the official Jack Off Jill Newsletter from the late 90s:
--Your songs are so full of pain and anger, are they about specific people/events?
"Oh definitely! You can only write about what you know, and what you feel. I mean, most people who are actually successful in writing music and/or poetry will tell you that the basic rule is 'write what you know!'. It is hard enough to step into someone else's shoes by being an actor, but in
writing it is almost impossible!"
--What was it like growing up in your house?
"Turbulent, to say the least. There are a lot of reflections, issues, and problems that I revisit in JOJ because - and I think I can speak for Robin [Moulder, JOJ bassist and co songwriter] here too -there are a lot of times where those experiences come into play with our band because our formative years were not as....easy...for us as they were for most people. Not to say that other people don't have problems, that is just kind of the way we handle it in the band - like with the references to nursery rhymes in our music.
--Was there something specific that happened in your childhood that really helped to mold you into the person you are today?
"Being my father's daughter. Maybe some people would see certain things that happened as negative, but I see them as positive - they just gave me strength."
Jessicka.com FAQ archived, 2011:
WHY DON'T YOU USE YOUR LAST NAME?
I'm not a fan of the person it belongs to so I became my own person without it. I'm officially an Addams now.
Jessicka.com FAQ archived, 2004:
Why do you cut your self that much? what is the reasons?
J: The question might be why did I cut myself so much? I initially started cutting myself at an early age out of frustration. Cutting tends to relieve anger. Many self-injurers like myself have enormous amounts of rage within and are sometimes afraid to express it outwardly, we injure ourselves as a way of venting these feelings without hurting others. When intense feelings built, I became overwhelmed and unable to deal with it. By causing pain, I could reduce the level of emotional stress to a bearable one. As a teenager it was an escape from the numbness many of those who self-injure say they do it in order to feel something, to know that they're still alive. You obtain a certain feeling of euphoria. Continuing abusive patterns later in life became more force of habit an adrenal rush on stage rather then a cry for help
The songs on Sexless Demons and Scars are unsettling. Jessicka's voice bounces between sweet innocence and manic screams, reflecting the conflict between expectations and less-than-perfect reality. "I didn't get to have as much of a childhood as I would have wanted," Jessicka says by way of explanation. "I think that reflects in our music. Wanting to be a good kid, but not being able to accomplish it. You have the little girl wearing the pink dress but spilling mud all over it by the time the song is over. My vocals start off innocent and then I trip myself up to go into a rage. It's not always an angry rage. Sometimes the rage is just frustration."
"I think there was a point in time where I wasn't allowed to be a child," says vocalist/lyrical diva Jessicka. "And that's why I can play it out more now. Terror always builds better girls… the better girls have been through it all," she says.
Jessicka interviewed for Seconds in 1998.
Seconds: What sort of things do you like to do in bed?
Jessicka: I like to pretend that I am the little girl and my partner -- he or she - is the molester. You can draw conclusions -
what do you fantasize about when you masturbate? The little girl thing?
Seconds: You weren't molested as a little girl, were you?
Jessicka: Yeah, but I'd rather not go there. Is that okay?
Seconds: That's fine.
Jessicka: I'm not ashamed in any way.
Regarding the last quote, there's the song French Kiss The Elderly with the following lyrics:
I'm not so pretty now
They're filthy next to me
I'm staring at myself
In family therapy
I'm dying day by day
But no one cries for me
They'd rather slit their wrists
Than french kiss the elderly!
On the day we broke you made the
On the day that we die
On the day we broke you made the whole world
Stop it, you're hurting me
Stop it, you're hurting me
Stop it, you're hurting me
This doesn't sound like it's about a boyfriend, but about something that happened before the forming of Jack Off Jill.
So what comes through here is that there definitely was something traumatizing in her youth before Jeordie came along and that was an inspiration to these lyrics, lyrics to songs that existed before the alleged abuse. These lyrics aren't proof that Jeordie did anything.
The idea that these songs are about childhood trauma is also supported by the fact that it seemed that part of the idea behind Jessicka's dress look was to combine the innocence of a child with evil.
Seconds: A lot of your images deal with the blending of innocence and decadence, purity and filth.
Jessicka: That the way I live my life. I act and think like a child but I have the heart of a demon in which lust and decadence swell and dance around. I open up a book and see it with a child's eyes but with the devil's mind.
In her 2000s website bio her 90's look is described like this:
grade school ghoulie, dead girl, kinder goth
This goes along with the Kinderwhore style in general, but in Jack Off Jill, childhood was a theme that was there in the looks and aesthetics. There were dolls and toys in band promos and for example the My Cat - music video.
An instagram story/tweet from Jack Off Jill, dated February 25, 2023 further confirms that the earlier JOJ lyrics could not have been about Jeordie. According to this tweet, Jessicka wrote the lyrics from the songs on the compilation album Humid Teenage Mediocrity 1992-1996 (2006) when she was 15 to 16 years old. She says her relationship to Jeordie began at the age of 18. This would confirm both that these songs being written predate the relationship and also that these lyrical themes were a part of Jack Off Jill from the beginning with no influence from Jeordie.
Humid Teenage mediocrity is a compilation album containing the early releases of Jack Off Jill that were released independently prior to the debut album Sexless Demons and Scars. There are demo versions of the debut album songs included too.
Considering this, it's very interesting that the angriest Jack Off Jill songs that most obviously refer to experiences of abuse, according to this tweet, would have been written before the relationship and the alleged abuse happened. (As I have noted on this page, but she is confirming it). But she has also suggested that she has expressed her Jeordie claims through her song lyrics. It doesn't make sense. Sure, there were Jack Off Jill songs written later too, but it is exactly this early stuff she says was written before the relationship, that even contains the word rape. Why does abuse as a lyrical theme seem to lessen AFTER the relationship she claims to have been writing about?
There are two JOJ songs that could be about Jeordie though. First I'm going to discuss the one on the last album.
This album, Clear Hearts, Grey Flowers, came out in July 2000 and it includes the songs Nazi Halo and Author Unknown. The latter, admitted by Jessicka, is about the things Marilyn Manson wrote about her in his biography Long Hard Road Out Of Hell.
The link in the tweet: Author Unknown on Youtube.
But the song Nazi Halo, considering that this is after their relationship and there's another song on the album about Marilyn Manson, it's very likely this is about Jeordie. But let's look at the lyrics, the following parts are interesting.
Can't keep my mouth shut
If you keep that dress on
You can't negotiate
Not with me this time
You go so low
Your faggot rainbow
Your Nazi Halo
Won't save you this time
You go so low
Your tragic disco
Your Nazi Halo
Won't save you this time
You go so low
Your faggot rainbow
Your junkie ego
Won't save you this time
Dress mentioned, Jessicka had already at this point mentioned in interviews that she believes Jeordie copied her style. More on that claim here.
Nazi Halo could mean just the fame brought by being in Marilyn Manson, who has had nazi uniform sort of aesthetics in his stage show and outfits. Antichrist Superstar era outfits and stage props and the album theme in general combined this with religious imagery. Antichrist Superstar is also the first album where Jeordie was a songwriter in the band. Marilyn Manson being the "halo", as in the thing that brought Jeordie into the famous position he was in, implying that without the position in Marilyn Manson, Jeordie is no better than Jessicka.
( As in the more recent discussions Manson has been accused of Nazism, I will remind that the imagery was meant as artistic expression, not to glorify. Manson's work has always contained criticism of fascism and that is why it is a theme played with. )
Then there's "Your junkie ego" which could refer to the fact that Jeordie was known for using drugs in the 90's and it came through especially in the album Mechanical Animals, 1998. Maybe she implies that the drug use and the position in Marilyn Manson really got to his head. Jeordie has admitted to it;
"You just forget about taking care of yourself and just being a good person and being nice to people around you. One's ego can get so inflated and get so crazy and full of this power that you think that you have, you just do stupid things. At the time I didn't think I was doing anything wrong. I don't have any regrets, really. But I wouldn't act the way I acted then, now. Never in a million years. I see people in other bands — this makes me feel old, kind of — I see people in other bands coming up, looking and behaving only a tiny, tiny percentage of the way I did. I was way more ridiculous. Much, much bigger of an (bleep). These guys are idiots. I think I can say that 'cause I was worse."
Tragic disco could refer to the disco influences on the at the time newest Marilyn Manson album, Mechanical Animals. The disco influences were evident in the metallic silver and gold outfits and platform boots that Jeordie wore at the time.
But what does she mean with faggot rainbow? Could it have something to do with Marilyn and Twiggy's close friendship and the way they would encourage the rumours that they're a gay couple by kissing on stage etc.? Or is it a jab towards the fact that Jeordie was, at the time, a guy wearing a dress and a lot of makeup, and Jessicka was bitter that he was so much more successful. (JOJ member Michelle Inhell said in an interview in 2015 that this was the case, that there was bitterness towards Jeordie for him having more money to buy outfits)
Rainbow, could refer to the dresses Jessicka claims Jeordie stole, as he wore a series of different coloured dresses, pink, red, blue and green.
Part of the reason Jeordie got far more attention than Jessicka was also the fact that he was a man wearing a dress, and because of his androgynous look and the friendship with Manson, there were rumours that he was gay, intersex or trans, which, at the time was a lot more taboo than now, so it made him more interesting to the public. Jessicka herself is and already was then openly bisexual, maybe Jeordie being in the spotlight seemingly joking about being gay felt annoying. It could be that Jessicka would have wished for more recognition for being openly bi but it was Jeordie who got both the sexuality discussion and the dress look under his name in the public eye, he got to shock people by kissing Manson in a music video and he got to pose naked in a gay magazine, (haha not behind the link though, you have to look for those pics yourself, it's just a news article about said appearance, as you know, a source) and maybe that's what this song is about;
Jeordie doing the things Jessicka wants recognition for, she thinks all he is is fake and she herself is the real thing and the only reason Jeordie is famous is Manson and the only reason he feels good about himself is just his ego and the drugs.
You're so predictable no shadow of doubt
When you are suffering know who sold you out
Fuck your opinions
Fuck your lack of spine
When you are miserable
Know that I'm just fine
(Here I could see a reference to the lyrics on Antichrist Superstar: "When you are suffering, know that I have betrayed you." This then on Manson's end is likely a reference to Aleister Crowley in the Book Of the Law "then when you are sad, know that I have forsaken you" - Considering that Nazi Halo is on the same album with Author Unknown, which seems to be written in reaction to LHROOH, which details the writing process of ACSS, this is interesting.)
It doesn't really look like a revenge song about an abusive relationship. Jack Off Jill songs have been more aggressive than this, there is no mention of rape or violence in this song at all. Rather, this song sounds more like a song about an ex that Jessicka thinks has let the fame go to his head.
He's famous simply for being in Marilyn Manson and it can be taken away from him at any point and Jessicka believes that she'll be doing fine when he's not because she thinks she has more personality and original ideas that will drive her forward.
But these feelings towards Jeordie could be rooted simply in envy.
You see, Jack Off Jill was formed in late 1992, and the beginning of the band was helped by Marilyn Manson. Jack Off Jill's first shows were opening for Marilyn Manson, the band's name was originally going to be Jack In Jill, but Manson suggested the word change to Jack Off Jill. Manson also helped produce their first demos and took them onto their first tour in 1994.
At the time of forming Jack Off Jill and playing their first shows, Jeordie was not a member of Marilyn Manson yet, he would join the band in December 1993.
So if we look at what was going on: Jack Off Jill is greatly helped by the association to Marilyn Manson and Jessicka is friends with Manson. Jeordie joins Marilyn Manson on a short notice, Portrait Of An American Family is released and it takes Jeordie on a big tour with Marilyn Manson, opening for Nine Inch Nails. Jeordie has the short relationship with Courtney Love on this tour, (Jessicka claims he cheated but the timeline of their relationship is very unclear, either way, it would be no wonder to feel like she's left behind. "Fuck your lack of spine" in the song could refer to a breakup that happened in a "cowardly way") Marilyn Manson gets really big while Jack Off Jill stays a fairly underground band that is compared to Marilyn Manson and seemingly overshadowed by it, with opinions such as "Jack Off Jill is basically the girl version of Marilyn Manson". Jeordie is seen on TV wearing black dreadlocks and a vintage dress, a look that Jessicka wore and that Jessicka claims was simply copied from her.
So from this we could probably understand that they had a relationship, the breakup wasn't pretty and Jeordie joining Marilyn Manson and dressing in the Kinderwhore look kind of turned Jessicka's association to Marilyn Manson against her. The attention Manson was bringing her turned to comparisons to him and Jeordie, because people simply had seen Jeordie first in the press.
Whether or not this was his intention depends on the point of view you look at this, but the whole "He stole my dress" issue in itself could be rooted in how this basically looks like Jeordie snatched her dream right from her hands and became far more successful. But by the looks of it, luck was on his side and he was at the right place at the right time, but Jessicka's own emotions could affect the way she sees this, making her believe that Jeordie intended to mock her and copy her. It just is how she sees it.
IF this song is about him. But if there is a Jack Off Jill song about Jeordie, this is probably the best guess.
Last thing about Nazi Halo: Many people have expressed their distaste for the use of the word "faggot" in the song Nazi Halo. It is a homophobic slur, yes, but you have to understand that the times were different in the 1990's and if you're looking to "cancel" Jack Off Jill only for using this word, it isn't really fair, considering that many other bands used "problematic" language in their songs at the time, and also, in the album booklet of Smells Like Children, Jeordie was credited for "fag bass". It doesn't really seem like he found the word offensive himself.
It's a question of intent, though, as there in that booklet Jeordie is using the word to describe himself, but if it's used by someone else to describe him with malicious intent, it's a little different. While it may not be offensive to him when he uses it, someone else's intention with it can make it hurtful. I'm against censorship and think that the intention behind the words mean more than the words themselves. But if Nazi Halo is about Jeordie, what is the intention behind the use of the word faggot? That is for the listener to think about. That being said I don't agree with people who just flat out go "This word was used and therefore the song is bad." as I don't think art should be read with the artist being always held responsible for the consumer's perception of what it's saying especially with things picked out of context. That'd be a pretty slippery slope.
I'm not going to get offended FOR Jeordie, I just think it's a stupid thing to say in a song and tells more about Jessicka and her hypocritical values. And this song is so old by now that I don't think Jeordie even remembers it - did he pay attention when it was released? Doubt. But in addition to how offensive her whole narrative about Jeordie being sick for wearing dresses is, this "faggot rainbow" thing I do find offensive. And while personally I don't really care to debate on what words are offensive in songs released forever ago, - If simply stating that "Jessicka wrote songs" and the word "dress" in this song was enough for some to call him a rapist "bc she even wrote songs about him", surely it can't be unfair to call out homophobia for the use of "faggot" when it's clearly directed towards a recognizable person.
Jessicka hasn't taken the criticism for this song very well, though. Either than "faggot" isn't a slur or that people are bullying her for using the wrong word in a song 20 years ago. How about address it and explain what you meant with it, why it was in the song or whatever instead of making it a "they are all against me" point as if she couldn't see why people have a problem with it?
July 2022 addition: Let's discuss Angels Fuck, Devils Kiss.
Another song I decided to add on this page, though I have briefly discussed it on the When did they date? - page, as it kind of contradicts Jessicka's timeline of the relationship, is Angels Fuck, Devils Kiss. This song definitely does have a tone that it could be about Jeordie, and there have been implications about that being the case. And recently, in May 2022 Jessicka was once again ranting on Twitter and instagram and pretty much confirmed that this song is supposed to be about Jeordie. Alright.
Here's the tweet, and as you can see it includes an instagram story that, along with the claims of Jeordie being a serial abuser/rapist, contains song lyrics, most likely added with the instagram music tool that lets you add a song playing to the background and you can choose to have the lyrics appear on the screen as they play out in the song. Those lyrics are from Angels Fuck, Devils Kiss, further on referred to as AFDK.
The other claim, Jeordie stating he ”doesn't remember” is actually false, he never said that in response to the allegations, that is discussed here on the Can't remember? -page, and anyone who followed closely since the beginning knows he never said that; Jeordie ”not remembering that” was just a common comment that people speculating at the time had as a result of his history of heavy drug/alcohol use in the 90's. ”He probably doesn't even remember any of the 90's” was a common idea already before the allegations. It is also explained on that page with proof, that it is Jessicka posting behind the JOJ account though she claims it's an ”admin” and not her.
Anyway, to the song. AFDK was included on the JOJ debut album Sexless Demons and Scars, (released September 1997) And according to Jessicka it's about a relationship ending badly (further quote below in more detail)
Jessicka's timeline since the 90's was that her and Jeordie dated for four years, from 1993 to 1997. This already is pretty interesting, because this song being released on this album does kind of set doubt over her timeline that she was maintaining at the time. Why? Because it takes a long time between the songwriting process of an album and the release of an album. For this song to be about a breakup with Jeordie, the breakup most likely would have happened earlier than 1997. The song would have been in the process of being written already in 1996 if not even earlier.
For comparison, she was writing songs for Clear Hearts, Grey Flowers, which was released in 2000, already in 1998 as discussed in this interview from the time. Similarly, the Manson album Portrait Of An American Family was recorded in August-December 1993 and released in June 1994. There can be easily a year between the songs being written and them being released on an album. Jack Off Jill used pretty old songs on their albums too, since it took a long time for them to get a record deal, on the very same album with AFDK was the song My Cat, which already was played live very early on, 1993-1994.
What else points to the direction of them breaking up before 1997 is that Jeordie, according to JOJ sources, dated JOJ member Helen Storer in 1996 too. Also, Jessicka's alleged abuse timeline really ends in 1994 and there are literally no pictures of the two together after 1995 despite both of them getting far more cameras shoved in their face towards the late 90's. It could very well be that AFDK was written already in 1996 or even 1995. But had they actually dated until 1997, a "breakup song" would have ended up on the next album for sure.
Also, if AFDK was about Jeordie being terribly abusive and raping Jessicka, why on earth would they include it on the same album with My Cat? As discussed above on this very same page, it's very likely that that song was about Jeordie, - but positively! We are talking about 1997, which is when Jessicka claimed to be planning to come out with her story and being silenced, why would she even want to include this song on the album?
But so what did Jessicka say about AFDK in the 90's?
Jessicka interviewed for issue 5 of the official JOJ Newsletter:
--What do you mean by "help destroy the world" in 'Angel's fuck'? "
"It is symbolism for a relationship. We have all had --or wanted to have-a kind of a symbiotic 'us against the world' type of relationship....a Bonnie and Clyde, or a Mickey and Mallory kind of thing. This song is about that relationship going bad. Instead of the two of you against the world, it ends
up being just you.
Still the same interview:
--What is your favorite lyrically?
"Probably 'Working with Meat' and Angel's Fuck' ."
--What is your most intensely personal JOJ song?
"That is a really hard question! I put a little of myself into all of the songs. Each song at different times is relevant to my life, and has a strong effect...it just depends on where I am at that point of time."
So this is not even the most intensely personal song on the album either apparently? Though later it's heavily implied this song is some evidence about abuse? And in the same interview she describes her rough childhood (quotes already on this page) rather than an abusive ex.
Alright, it's a song about a relationship ending badly. But if you really look into the lyrics, this song does sound more like it's about being rejected and left by someone, not about escaping someone. The lyrics continue... ”I wanted to help destroy the world, I wanted to be that special girl.”
She mentions Bonnie and Clyde and she mentions Mickey and Mallory. Well this does give a different perspective to it. What happened with Mickey and Mallory? This is from the movie Natural Born Killers (1994)
Mickey kills Mallory's abusive parents and takes her with him to basically destroy everything, they get engaged and kill a bunch of people on a crime rampage across the country, the media makes them famous and the public treats them like celebrities. It's definitely a destroy the world together, us against the world. The cops are after them but the public loves them like they're rockstars. This song does come across as her wanting that kind of a relationship and losing it and the Mickey and Mallory comparison does shed light on what "special girl" meant.
”I'll bask in your forever, you just waste my time” - ”I'm living in humid teenage mediocrity” I could take these lines to mean that she thought they would be together forever, but that forever that she thought was promised to her didn't end up happening. A waste of time said after an ended relationship, - well if you put a lot of time and effort into someone and you don't get that back, that's what you say. It's a waste of time when you don't get what you want.
Humid teenage mediocrity, well I think the word humid could just refer to Florida. In interviews around the time, Jessicka did mention that humidity and Florida being hell and wanting to get out of there. Does she think she herself is mediocre or that her surroundings are mediocre? As in "this scene where I'm at is not filled with the kind of people I need to know to get where I want to be" ?
Seconds: Did you grow up in Florida?
Jessicka: Yeah, that's where I met Mr. Manson. I'm sure a lot of people have used this to describe Florida, but I'll say it again: Florida is hell. It's hot and the humidity makes people act crazy. No one realizes what a Florida summer can do to you physically and emotionally. If gets to one hundred-plus and you're outside with twenty other people, there could be a riot. It's appropriate that Marilyn Manson did most of his work in Florida. I was born and raised in Florida, so that pretty much explains me right there.
What comes through from this song to me at least is rejection rather than escaping abuse. Basically: ”You promised me forever, you were supposed to take me out of here and take me with you” That can be taken as whether it's to fame by association or having that dream come true together. This song does not sound like a revenge anger anthem against an abusive partner, it sounds like a ”Fuck you for leaving me” - song.
I woke up mourning
I woke up dead today
I aged a thousand years or more
I flinch when you are nice
You kill me with a single word
When angels fuck and devils kiss
- "Woke up mourning, woke up dead today". Could just be feelings about being left and not being able to deal with those feelings at the time. ”I flinch when you are nice, you kill me with a single word.” If someone you're trying to get over is being nice, it can feel bad, because it reminds you of why you were into that person. If you get rejected, for some people it's easier to get over it when concentrating on the negativity and when you don't get negativity, it's frustrating because it doesn't fuel the anger but it fuels the longing for the good memories.
I'll bask in your forever
You just waste my time
I wanna drag you down, down with me
I wanted to help, to help destroy the world
I wanted to be that, to be that special girl
Everybody's got a little something to hide, but me
Everybody's got a little someone to crush, but me
I'm living in humid teenage mediocrity
Everybody's got a little someone to trust, but me
I dreamed that I was you
I dreamed your ego died
Said, "Who loves you more than I do?"
I know you lied
- You did read the analysis on the song Nazi Halo. The ”ego” point is here too. This and the ”Everybody's got a little something to hide but me” has the very same tone as the song Nazi Halo, she thinks Jeordie is arrogant and fake and claims to know ”who he truly is behind all that”. ”I wanna drag you down” and the line in Nazi Halo; ”Know who sold you out.” This song is basically the same story as that. Jeordie's an asshole and he's fake and Jessicka wants to drag him down. She wanted to be where he is and she thought she deserved everything more than he did. This is very clear in her behavior to this day.
I'll bask in your forever
Fucking waste of time
Angels fuck and devils screw
I wanted to heal me and then destroy the world
Piss in your heart and be that, and be that special girl
- A variation to the ”help destroy the world” - ”I wanted to heal me and then destroy the world.” Was she expecting the relationship to Jeordie to be a thing that ”saves” her, expecting him to take care of her, or having a relationship in general to be a thing that solves her problems?
("save" - Often people who have had a traumatic childhood for example, find comfort in something known as "Magical thinking" that can be for example so that another person will come to their life and rid them of their problems, or "when I find a significant other it will solve my problems and everything will be good", "Some day I'll win the lottery," this can be because of the fact that as a child you're often forced to wait things out as you have no power over the conflicts in your life, and it later in life can stay as an unhealthy pattern where you don't recognize your own responsibility or ability to change and you're waiting for something to happen, maybe partly because you lack the courage to work your way through your issues due to a crushed self esteem. This can result in high expectations for a friendship or a romantic relationship, or a vindictive attitude when it ends, because "you were supposed to be the thing that gets me out of this." - Heal me, I wanted to be that special girl, in the same song surely could point to a direction such as this.)
Or a ”This will take me out of this shitty town which will solve my problems.”
"Piss in your heart and be that special girl" - This could sound like, sometimes after a relationship ends in a bitter way, the one that feels rejected wants to "have the upper hand" in things such as success or the like, more so, "You were supposed to be the one whose heart's broken, not me." If anyone's had a tumultuous relationship/friendship, this may sound familiar, there's almost competition on who was the "one to end it", to make the decision, who rejected who, who "won." "I wasn't good enough for you? - No, you were not good enough for me!"
But me, but you
Love me, love me, hate you
Want me, fuck you, hate me
Fuck me like you want me
Like you, want you, fuck you
Fuck me, fuck you
Fuck you, fuck you, fuck me
Fuck you, fuck me
Fuck you, fuck you, fuck me
Fuck you, fuck you, fuck you
Fuck you, fuck me
I will never make it better
It will always hurt, you fucking asshole!
"Fuck me like you want me?" What did I say about this song seeming to be more about rejection? This would sound more like, if you also think of the "waste my time" thing in this very song, as well as the "want you, love me, love me" - was this a setting where she wanted something more and Jeordie just saw it as a hook up? Did she feel like she was used when the relationship didn't end up the way she wanted it? What else could it mean? Surely you wouldn't say that addressing someone who had raped you? Or is feeling used after a relationship didn't go the way it was expected where the rape claim started from?
I mean, personal experience but I had a crush on a guy for several years, then finally he noticed me and we had some things going on. Then he suddenly out of nowhere had a girlfriend and I felt so ashamed and regretted what I'd done with him because my interest in partaking in all that was based on the expectation that he'd be as into me as I was into him. But he wasn't and I was crushed. Felt like he'd just used me. That feeling was the first thing I felt when I found out about that girlfriend. And oh man I did write song lyrics about that!! Fortunately never published them anywhere as they were garbage. Considering this it is interesting how her alleged rape supposedly took place as she found out about Jeordie & Courtney.
This song comes across as being far more clearly about emotional hurt rather than any abuse trauma. And it doesn't really depict anything more than ”ego” ”asshole” etc, it is a song about being rejected. Which, if we think about the whole Courtney Love situation once again, it fits. Could it just be so that Jeordie left her for Courtney and that was it.
Why is it that the most "obvious" ”This is about Jeordie” songs only really actually end up sounding/looking like they're more about being rejected than about escaping someone abusive? And they don't necessarily actually depict anything even pointing to the direction of rape. Of course song lyrics are art and understanding them depends on how you see them, I can't really use these as any kind of conclusive evidence but well neither should anyone else. You wouldn't call someone that traumatized you a ”waste of time.” ?
I think these songs are more proof of Jessicka's vindictiveness than any violence happening.
Also to bring up Natural Born Killers in the context of Jeordie is definitely interesting too. On the Can't Drive? - page it's discussed how Natural Born Killers includes a scene that could very likely have influenced Jessicka's abuse claims.
She states that Jeordie ripped off the rearview mirror in the car while driving as ”he just couldn't bear to face himself after what he'd done” - in Natural Born Killers, Mickey accidentally shoots a native american old man, after which he tries to flee in a pickup truck, overwhelmed with guilt, but as he tries to start the car, he sees a zombified image of his own face flash in the mirror and jumps out of the car screaming. Not only that but this movie sure has a lot of that erratic driving that she described anyway.
I did, with the mention of NBK think that maybe this song could also have been about Jessicka's friendship to Marilyn Manson, as she mentioned it many times that when she was arrested with Manson in late 1994, the police officers called her and Manson "Mickey and Mallory" as the movie had just recently come out. That maybe their friendship was the "Us against the world" or the bands getting started together was the "Us against the world" relationship. We can't exactly shut that possibility out either, it could be that this song refers to both Manson and Jeordie but has been written more to address a singular "You" so that it would be more relatable to the listener as just a "breakup song".
So no, Jack Off Jill's lyrics are not all "revenge songs about abusive Jeordie", there is much more to it.
What they could rather prove is that maybe Jessicka was abused by someone and that someone wasn't Jeordie. And all this is now put on him because of an age old grudge. We didn't go through all the lyrics, but if these earlier songs aren't provably about him, then the rest of the songs really cannot be proven to be about him either, because the theme existed in the songs already. Song lyrics in general anyway... What a shitty argument.
And then there is the question: Had these songs been written about Jeordie, had this all happened, where are the rest of the band? One might think that the rest of the members of a band with such a feminist message would have loudly come forward with their witness statements, backing Jessicka up. But there has been no such thing.
In 2015, when Jessicka hinted about Jeordie being an abuser and stealing her style, Michelle Inhell gave an interview at around the same time, completely contradicting what Jessicka had said.
Michelle said that she is friends with Jeordie since high school and that Jessicka and Twiggy's stage looks were developed together side by side, exchanging ideas, and Jeordie's success caused bitterness because he was able to buy more makeup and outfits while Jack Off Jill was still "dragging the same old shit around."
This is an interesting detail for the reason that in her 2017 statement, Jessicka claimed that she planned on coming out with her abuse claims already in 1997, but was warned to stay silent by the record company that feared that a feud with Marilyn Manson would damage both the label and Jessicka's career. Planning a thing that would involve the reputation of the band, she likely would have told her band members about the alleged abuse at least by this time already, both for support and hearing their opinion on what to do. And considering how Jessicka's style of handling conflicts is always open and loud, it would be unlikely that she wouldn't have shared her frustration about being "silenced" with her bandmates.
Somehow Michelle Inhell still is "friends since highschool" with Jeordie in 2015 and has no problem publicly stating that as Jessicka calls Jeordie an abuser in the media at the same time.
Another Jack Off Jill member, Helen Storer, was seen commenting support on Jeordie's girlfriend Michelle Siwy's posts on instagram where she defended him, and as of now, is still followed by Jeordie and Michelle on social media.
This made Jessicka publicly call Helen a rape apologist, to which JOJ's Tenni A Cha Cha did not reply kindly. Read the Helen drama page.
IT doesn't really look like the band is agreeing on this issue or backing Jessicka up whatsoever.